Kommersant/ Vlast 02.07.07: interview 2

 

"I Can’t Comment on Words of Someone Who Doesn’t Exist" — Lugovoi

Former KGB officer Andrei Lugovoi, who is accusing Boris Berezovsky and late Alexander Litvinenko of ties with British intelligence, refuted his own words saying in an interview with Kommersant Vlast that he and late Litvinenko didn’t sell any analytical materials about Russia to Britain. Meanwhile, Kommersant has found the author of the files that Litvinenko, according to Russian émigré Evgeny Limarev, was trying to sell to the Brits for €10,000.

Kommersant Vlast in July published excerpts from analytical papers that, according to French resident Evgeny Limarev, Alexander Litvinenko was trying to sell with his help in May 2006. Mr. Limarev told Vlast that it was Andrei Lugovoi who handed the materials to Mr. Litvinenko. Evgeny Limarev mentioned that Mr. Litvinenko assured him that the papers were unique as they had been drafted by the intelligence for top officials in the Kremlin. Mr. Limarev, however, said that this package of documents can be compiled by any Moscow PR agency.

 

This suggestion turned out to be true. Following Vlast’s issue in July, Kommersant got a call from a man from Center for Political Information. He said that the papers that Alexander Litvinenko was trying to sell to Britain were written by the center’s staff.

 

Center for Political Information (CPI) is an independent public organization registered in February 1997. It provides consulting information support. CPI’s web-site says that the company’s priority research lines are “forming and functioning of federal and regional elites and influence groups; social, political and economic situation both on the regional and federal levels; business corporations and multiparty system in Russia.” The center had more than 500 special reference publications between 1996 and 2006.

 

Alexey Mukhin has been at the helm of CPI since 1997. He graduated from Moscow’s Institute for History and Archives in 1995. From 1992 to 1996 he worked in the Panorama information and publishing center. He was also a co-founder of the Tsentr political information and consulting service.

 

“I Bumped into Litvinenko in the Russian Security Council in 1998”

 

We contacted CPI director general Alexey Mukhin and asked him to comment the information that we got from Evgeny Limarev.

 

“How confidential are these papers?”

 

“The excerpts that Vlast quoted were taken from our reference publication, “The System of Moscow Clubs. Elite, Lobbyists and Brain Centers” issued in 2006 and our monitoring for the balance of forces in high ranks [#122 as of March 2006]. We have been publishing these monitoring issues every other month since 2001. The reference guide on night clubs was compiled from my own information gathered by students of Russian Social University, so it can’t confidential by any means. The students went to closed clubs to gather information, so they actually carried out a journalist investigation. The monitoring of the balance of forces is an exclusive material. It is a limited edition which is distributed among CPI’s clients only – there are no more than a few dozens of them, anyway.”

 

“Are prices for your products comparable with those that Litvinenko was mentioning?”

 

“I don’t think it’s right to disclose our rates, but the sum that Litvinenko was offered was just named at random. [“The System of Moscow Clubs” is sold in online shops for 496 rubles a copy while the package of with CPI’s three latest monitoring reports is available from the company’s web-site for $1,000] I don’t know whether he wanted to mislead his potential buyers with this information. Perhaps, he was misled, or there was a certain chain of in-betweens in selling the papers which ultimately drove up the price.”

 

“How could he possibly get hold of your center’s materials?”

 

“I guess Litvinenko got the papers from a source in Russia who was using his relations with CPI. But we can’t be held responsible for where our materials end up. Excerpts from some of them are sometimes quoted in mass media where they got through third parties. Duma deputies use them. The papers caused some stir in the presidential administration and the White House.”

 

“Lugovoi claimed that he and Litvinenko managed to sell the information package – which is probably yours – to a British security firm. The FSB opened a criminal case on spying which is also based on this statement of Lugovoi.”

 

“Informational and analytical files of CPI are undoubtedly of interest to state officials and businessmen who work in Russia because they reflect a view of an analyst on developments in politics and economics. But these observations are solely based on open sources and interviews. Perhaps, the way one can present them (as an exclusive unpublished material, for example) can sometimes be misleading for those who think that Center for Political Information is some sort of a branch of intelligence services. But it isn’t so. We are a self-sufficient and self-financing organization. The government does not pay us.”

 

“Do you personally know Lugovoi or Limarev? Have you ever met Litvinenko?”

 

“I don’t know Lugovoi or Limarev personally. I saw Litvinenko by pure accident in the Russian Security Council in 1998. I just bumped into him in the corridor. That’s what my acquaintance with him came down to. Well, I knew him by sight, of course. I have been tracking Boris Berezovsky’s activities for quite a while. I have several publications about him. So, yes, I know the names of those involved in the Litvinenko poisoning scandal.”

 

“Do intelligence agencies keep track of your center?”

 

“Nearly all Russian intelligence services that I know of have shown interest towards CPI. One of the reasons is “The Russian Intelligence Services Guidebook” that we published in 2004 and which was checked for possible classified information. They regularly try to find out who I work for, but every time they discover that I’m just a researcher who keeps the society informed by publishing reference materials. If they do receive these files, it will be through unofficial sources.”

 

“I’ve Never Said Litvinenko and I Sold Russian Files to Somebody”

 

Like Evgeny Limarev suggested in an interview with Vlast, materials that Alexander Litvinenko was trying to present as top secret files turned out to be a work of an average Moscow political science agency. Mr. Limarev reported that the late political émigré could get the files from Andrei Lugovoi. Mr. Lugovoi said in several interviews in early June that Mr. Litvinenko had been the first to offer him to cooperate with British security companies. Mr. Lugovoi mentioned RISC Management and Erinys. The latter is a major private security firm which ensures security at oil and gas facilities worldwide.

 

Andrei Lugovoi told a news conference at the Interfax news agency on May 31: “I was approached to set up a joint business to protect of British investments in different spheres of Russian economy… I was paid a clearly too big remuneration. The payment was made through a Cyprus-registered offshore firm. I was alarmed by that, because it was public information that everyone could find on the Internet. I realized that the remuneration was to drag me into cooperation…” Mr. Lugovoi made more detailed comments in a June 4 interview with the Izvestia daily: “There are Brits who want to invest in Russia. But they are scared or just want to make sure their investments won’t be pilfered,” he said. “So, we were offering them various analytical materials in different spheres of the economy. We received money for these materials directly, and Litvinenko got 20 percent in cash from them. This is what he told me. If they were to transfer, say, $10,000, they would transfer $8,000 and give the rest to Litvinenko.” Mr. Lugovoi added in the interview that he soon got a bad feeling about the business and realized that British intelligence agents who worked in the above mentioned firms wanted to recruit him by dragging him into a business which came down to “the sale of the country.”

 

When Vlast tried to find out whether Andrei Lugovoi had indeed handed analytical files of CPI to Alexander Litvinenko, the former KGB employee said he was on holiday “by the sea” with Dmitry Kovtun and was quick to take his words back:

 

“I’ve never said Litvinenko and I sold informational and analytical files about Russia to anyone in England. Litvinenko is a traitor who deserves the worst treatment by all Russian citizens!”

 

“What do you think about statements of Evgeny Limarev who said you’d given Litvinenko a package of analytical materials and suggested selling them to British firms?”

 

“Limarev is a swindler. He has nothing to do with security, intelligence services or counterespionage. There are Ivanovs, Petrovs and Sidorovs. So he is a Sidorov who talks rubbish. You won’t find anyone who knows him. This is just virtual reality. I don’t know who decided to spin him. I can’t comment on words of someone who doesn’t exist.”

 

“Lugovoi No Longer Aware He’s Entangled in Dictated Testimony”

 

We gave Evgeny Limarev one more call to make sure he can confirm his existence. Here is what Mr. Limarev said:

 

“I’m here. It’s me, I’m real and alive – that was proved by dozens of journalists from all over the world who have been knocking on my front door since last November – often without permission – demanding answers from me as “one of the three people involved in the polonium scandal.” In Russia, there will be a lot of people to speak about me, too – a lot of public figures who I was connected with before April 1999 both for business and state matters. You can ask Senators Alexey Volin and Mikhail Margelov. Margelov has known me since I was a kid. I know both of them from the university, and later we did a PR project together. There are also Senator Boris Shpigel and Duma deputy Gennady Seleznev. The trouble is, some people would want me to be no longer here, but I survived.”

 

“Why do you think Lugovoi refute his own words?”

 

“Seems he is doing very bad. He’s scared. His whole life is falling apart. The only thought left is how to survive so that your protectors won’t kill you,” Mr. Limarev said. “I can perfectly understand him. I had it all in April 1999 when the same “partners” with shoulder straps robbed me of everything, tried to eliminate me, forced me out of the country and made me stay outside Russia. I suspect Lugovoi is no longer aware that he’s become entangled in that testimony for media that they dictated to him. He first mentioned the files in his news conference and he simply specified it in the interview with Izvestia. I’m afraid his masters will soon lose patience with him. Lugovoi is desperately failing the task, playing the part very badly. He’s becoming dangerous for those who contracted the murder of Litvinenko.”

 

“We Played with Toy Soldiers Together”

 

Federation Council Senator Mikhail Margelov confirmed in an interview with Kommersant Vlast that he is acquainted with Evgeny Limarev:

 

“Evgeny Limarev’s father and my father, Vitaly Margelov, both served in Soviet intelligence services. We were kids when our fathers were working in Morocco. We used to play with toy soldiers together. I was in grade three in the Russian school in the Soviet embassy in Rabat. Evgeny was in grade two. Later, when my father was working in Switzerland, Evgeny Limarev was also staying in that country. I didn’t see much of him at university. [They both graduated from the Institute of Asian and African Studies of Moscow University.] I studied Arabic, he did Farsi. We had different interests. The last time I heard of Limarev was somewhere around 1998 right after the financial crisis. I didn’t have any information about him after that. I only saw his name briefly mentioned in the press.

 

 

A letter from Litvinenko

 

Federation Council Senator from Pskov Region Mikhail Margelov

Alek Akhundov and Ekaterina Savina
http://www.kommersant.com/p779140/Litvinenko_Lugovoi_Murder_Limarev/